Just something I saw

The Dunedain · 11-01-2003, 11:19 AM

Okay, I was watching the ROTK tailer and I noteced that there was a Nazgul shining in white light. upon closer inspection, I saw that the light passed through him. This is no doubt the work of a certain White Wizard. Thoughtys? Also, it seems that Dernhelms secret identidy is not so secret(Gahhhhhhhhh!) and Eomer, unlike his book character, breaks down and sobs over Theoden's body. Oyh No PJ. You can take away Dernhelm (although that alone is flogging worthy) but Eomer will not Sod like a girl. In the book, he weeps, but c'mon. Sheeeeeeeeesh. I know I'm making a big deal, but Eomer rocks! Thanks for listening to me rant(bangs head against computer screen)

Black Breathalizer · 11-01-2003, 11:41 AM

Dernhelm is still Dernhelm. The only difference in the movie is that the audience will know in advance--which is a good thing. Keeping the reader in the dark is one thing, keeping a film audience in the dark is quite another.

The flim clip of Eomer is showing his dismay at the "death" of Eowyn, not Theoden.

jerseydevil · 11-01-2003, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Black Breathalizer
Dernhelm is still Dernhelm. The only difference in the movie is that the audience will know in advance--which is a good thing. Keeping the reader in the dark is one thing, keeping a film audience in the dark is quite another.

Hate to tell you this - but a lot of great movies keep the audience in the dark about many things. As I have said - you don't have to spoonfeed people like Jackson does. So to say that "keeping the film audience in the dark is quite another" is a erroneous statement. As an example - Jackson did not have to reveal that the dwarves were all dead upon entering moria. He could have built of the suspense of the audience wondering where they were.

Black Breathalizer · 11-01-2003, 12:54 PM

Let's get real here. Do you honestly believe Miranda Otto could have fooled the non-Tolkien film audience?

jerseydevil · 11-01-2003, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Black Breathalizer
Let's get real here. Do you honestly believe Miranda Otto could have fooled the non-Tolkien film audience?

What does the actress have to do with Eowyn? Are you saying that the actress isn't that good? And GOOD actress can make the audience believe almost anything - so can a good director.

***azalea*** · 11-01-2003, 02:41 PM

I will withhold my judgement about it until I see the movie, but I agree that it certainly could be done. (Remember The Crying Game?

) It would have been possible to have the audience think like Merry that she is a somewhat mysterious soldier (those helms they wore cover the face a lot, she could have bulked up with armor, and not said much, hair pulled up, etc.). If people guessed, so what, everyone who read the book would know anyway.
I'm not saying how it will be won't be good, I'm just saying I agree that it was possible to have made it a "secret." (I could see a lot of buildup of tension, with Eowyn doing a lot of complaining about not being able to ride, some of which we'd already gotten in TTT, so that when the helm comes off,
rrrrrAAAArrrr!

Millane · 11-02-2003, 02:16 AM

Quote:

As an example - Jackson did not have to reveal that the dwarves were all dead upon entering moria.

ahhh yes but then we'd be wondering "where are all the Dwarf corpses" and it seemed like a good point to break the suspense after the watcher it could've easily been lost if he tried to keep it up until Balin's Tomb...

jerseydevil · 11-02-2003, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Millane
ahhh yes but then we'd be wondering "where are all the Dwarf corpses" and it seemed like a good point to break the suspense after the watcher it could've easily been lost if he tried to keep it up until Balin's Tomb...

Not really - because eery silence - when you are walking into the unknown, can't see two feet in front of you and the way back is blocked - is scary in itself. He didn't need to have the dwarf corpses right in the beginning.

Also - one of the reasons why I don't think Tolkien had any Dwarf corpses in Lord of the Rings when they entered Moria - is plainly clear when you think of what Orcs ate. Why didn't the orcs collect the dwarves for food like what most likely would have been the case?

Tuor of Gondolin · 11-03-2003, 09:03 PM

Originally posted by Black Breathalizer
Dernhelm is still Dernhelm. The only difference in the movie is that the audience will know in advance--which is a good thing. Keeping the reader in the dark is one thing, keeping a film audience in the dark is quite another.
________________________________________________

I don't understand this point . Not only would it be a good thing to keep a movie audience in suspense, it could easily be done.
One scenario:

1-Have scene with Theoden telling her to stay and guard the civilians.
2-Eowyn holds reins of the horse she proposed to ride into combat. Looks upset as King walks away to prepare for the Ride.
Looks from horse to civilians to Theoden.
3-Then a distant shot of the people being led to safety with several horsed riders accompanying them, one of them, seemingly the leader, riding a horse which resembles Eowyn's.
4- Dernhelm offers Merry a ride.

As for the dwarf bodies in Moria. The movie scene works fine, but
you would think nassty orcsees would get the munchies after a long battle. And if not, didn't a hungry Gollum get to the inside of the West Gate?

11-01-2003, 11:19 AM	#1
The Dunedain Hobbit Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 24	Just something I saw Okay, I was watching the ROTK tailer and I noteced that there was a Nazgul shining in white light. upon closer inspection, I saw that the light passed through him. This is no doubt the work of a certain White Wizard. Thoughtys? Also, it seems that Dernhelms secret identidy is not so secret(Gahhhhhhhhh!) and Eomer, unlike his book character, breaks down and sobs over Theoden's body. Oyh No PJ. You can take away Dernhelm (although that alone is flogging worthy) but Eomer will not Sod like a girl. In the book, he weeps, but c'mon. Sheeeeeeeeesh. I know I'm making a big deal, but Eomer rocks! Thanks for listening to me rant(bangs head against computer screen)

11-03-2003, 09:03 PM	#9
Tuor of Gondolin Elf Lord Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Southeastern Pennsylvania Posts: 1,215	Originally posted by Black Breathalizer Dernhelm is still Dernhelm. The only difference in the movie is that the audience will know in advance--which is a good thing. Keeping the reader in the dark is one thing, keeping a film audience in the dark is quite another. ________________________________________________ I don't understand this point . Not only would it be a good thing to keep a movie audience in suspense, it could easily be done. One scenario: 1-Have scene with Theoden telling her to stay and guard the civilians. 2-Eowyn holds reins of the horse she proposed to ride into combat. Looks upset as King walks away to prepare for the Ride. Looks from horse to civilians to Theoden. 3-Then a distant shot of the people being led to safety with several horsed riders accompanying them, one of them, seemingly the leader, riding a horse which resembles Eowyn's. 4- Dernhelm offers Merry a ride. As for the dwarf bodies in Moria. The movie scene works fine, but you would think nassty orcsees would get the munchies after a long battle. And if not, didn't a hungry Gollum get to the inside of the West Gate? __________________ Democrat for Kerry-Edwards! Take Back America Aure entuluva! Last edited by Tuor of Gondolin : 11-03-2003 at 09:19 PM.

11-01-2003, 11:41 AM	#2
Black Breathalizer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 828	Dernhelm is still Dernhelm. The only difference in the movie is that the audience will know in advance--which is a good thing. Keeping the reader in the dark is one thing, keeping a film audience in the dark is quite another. The flim clip of Eomer is showing his dismay at the "death" of Eowyn, not Theoden.

11-01-2003, 12:54 PM	#4
Black Breathalizer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 828	Let's get real here. Do you honestly believe Miranda Otto could have fooled the non-Tolkien film audience?

11-01-2003, 02:41 PM	#6
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	I will withhold my judgement about it until I see the movie, but I agree that it certainly could be done. (Remember The Crying Game? ) It would have been possible to have the audience think like Merry that she is a somewhat mysterious soldier (those helms they wore cover the face a lot, she could have bulked up with armor, and not said much, hair pulled up, etc.). If people guessed, so what, everyone who read the book would know anyway. I'm not saying how it will be won't be good, I'm just saying I agree that it was possible to have made it a "secret." (I could see a lot of buildup of tension, with Eowyn doing a lot of complaining about not being able to ride, some of which we'd already gotten in TTT, so that when the helm comes off, rrrrrAAAArrrr!