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Old 03-13-2002, 12:22 AM   #1
Sister Golden Hair
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Finarfin, King of the Noldor in Valinor

When Finarfin forsook the long march into Middle-earth, he returned to Valinor and was given the rule of the remaining Noldor. Ingwe was king of all Elves. When the War of Wrath came Finarfin came to Middle-earth with a great many Vanyar to overthrow Morgoth. Who would have ruled the Noldor in his stead? Also, what became of the Noldorin Kingship in Valinor once the Elves of the First and Second Houses of Finwe, or Finwe himself were released from Mandos?
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Old 03-13-2002, 01:25 AM   #2
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Somewhere in the late HoMe books it's said or implied that Finwe never returned to the living, but remained in Mandos with M*riel. Manwe did not even judge Fëanor because of his particularly grave case, and passed the decision making on to the One. It's not known what became of him. I believe he remained in Mandos until the end of it. Finrod might have been the one who ruled the Noldor in the stead of Finarfin. That's my take. But as you point out there are other things to consider. The fates of Fingolfin, Fingon, Turgon and Aredhel are really up in the air.
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Old 12-25-2006, 12:14 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ñólendil
Finrod might have been the one who ruled the Noldor in the stead of Finarfin.
How so? I know when Finrod died in the sil it was said "But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar." However, I never took those words literally, but it is a happy thought.

I would think by this time Finarfin would himself have other sons or heirs, and the kingship or stewardship of the noldo would fall to them.

I think when the end of days comes and the will of Eru is fulfilled, all will be released from the halls of Mandos; Finwe will be high king again, Feanor will be as he should have and all of his brothers, feanor will release the lights of the silmarilli and awaken the trees again and morgoth will be dealt a final death blow by the sword arm of Turin Turambar Mormegil.
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Old 12-25-2006, 01:19 PM   #4
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Finarfin’s rule over the Noldor of Valinor was in fulfillment of the words of the Prophecy of the North: “On the House of Fëanor the wrath of the Valar lieth from the West unto the uttermost East... The Dispossessed shall they be for ever.” Fingolfin followed his elder brother Fëanor into Middle-earth, persevering even through the hellish crossing of the Helcaraxë; but Finarfin wisely turned back upon the border of Araman, and led some of his people home to Tirion. After the death of Fëanor, Fingolfin reigned as King of the Noldor in Beleriand; but after the death of Gil-galad in Mordor, the only recognized King of the Noldor was Finarfin, youngest of Finwë’s three sons.

Finwë did remain in Mandos so that M*riel, his first wife, might be among the Living: for no living Elf could have two spouses, and Indis did not die. Fëanor was held in Mandos because of the magnitude of his evil deeds. Fingolfin had rebelled against the Noldor and followed Fëanor into Middle-earth. Only Finarfin repented, and accepting the forgiveness and grace of the Valar, returned to the city of the Noldor to take up the throne of his father.

Last edited by Alcuin : 12-25-2006 at 01:21 PM.
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Old 12-25-2006, 03:12 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alcuin
Fëanor was held in Mandos because of the magnitude of his evil deeds.
I read in the unfinished tales that Feanor would be allowed to come back, and he would release the light from his sacred jewels to rekindle the trees.
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Proverbs 21:3
To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice.

Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5
1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation...
...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity.

Romans 5:3
And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
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Old 12-26-2006, 12:08 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Telcontarion
I read in the unfinished tales that Feanor would be allowed to come back, and he would release the light from his sacred jewels to rekindle the trees.
I believe that you are referring to the Second Prophecy of Mandos in §32 in the “Conclusion” to “Quenta Silmarillion” in The Lost Road. Fëanor’s release from Mandos and his grant of the Silmarils to Yavanna is also mentioned in §19 of “The Quenta” in Shaping of Middle-earth. In both of these passages, Fëanor is freed from Mandos only after the return of Morgoth and his final defeat in the ruin of Arda in the Dagor Dagorath at the end of the world. In other words, in both of these tellings, Fëanor is locked up in Mandos until the end of Time because of his wicked deeds, he is not even released for the Final Battle between Good and Evil (at least, it is not presented that way), but only after the battle is won, and then primarily to repair his fault of pride.

As far as I know, the only reference to the Second Prophecy of Mandos in Unfinished Tales has to do with Manwë, not Fëanor, and is in the essay “Istari”.
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Old 12-26-2006, 11:24 AM   #7
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that sounds right.
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Proverbs 21:3
To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice.

Ecclesiasticus 2:1-5
1 My son, if thou come to serve the Lord, prepare thy soul for temptation...
...4 Whatsoever is brought upon thee take cheerfully, and be patient when thou art changed to a low estate. 5 For gold is tried in the fire, and acceptable men in the furnace of adversity.

Romans 5:3
And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Fëanor is locked up in Mandos until the end of Time because of his wicked deeds, he is not even released for the Final Battle between Good and Evil (at least, it is not presented that way), but only after the battle is won, and then primarily to repair his fault of pride.
I was under the impression that Feanor was not released after the battle, but rather near the end of it, and his gift of the Silmarilli and the restoration of the Light of Valinor was a means of winning the war, though Tolkien did not express who actually triumphed in the end. Am I mistaken and did he expressly state that Melkor was defeated?
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