Natural Selection or Preordained?

Grey_Wolf · 09-15-2009, 12:21 AM

School are often rife with fractions - the computor club - the chess club - the jocks - and their inevitable gf's - the cheerleeders - the goth girls - the punks and so on.

This kind of group creations Ive often wondered about.

Is it natural selection - that is do these people live their group lives according to the age-old edict of "Survival of the Fitest" - meaning that geeks are geeks and jocks are jocks and never the two shall mingle.

Or is it - in some way - preordained. A person that likes books, chess and computors - are they really supposed to be marked for life with the epithet Geeks?

And the same goes for those who are very sports-oriented - are they forever also branded Jocks? Not to mention the usual image of cheerleaders - superficial airhead - is this also a given?

Glad to know your views on the matter.

**Mari** · 09-15-2009, 10:11 AM

We do not have those groups in high school. At least, they did not exist in mine.
We hardly had groups at all, except for the smokers who had their own little place on the schoolgrounds, but that's it. I guess it has nothing to do with preordainment then

***Jonathan*** · 09-15-2009, 12:01 PM

GW, the reality you describe is very black-and-white. Are you sure things really are that stereotyped?

Grey_Wolf · 09-15-2009, 12:16 PM

Well there must be some basis for all these teenage movies, dont you think?

***Jonathan*** · 09-15-2009, 12:23 PM

Well it isn't a teen movie if it isn't ridiculously stereotyped

inked · 09-15-2009, 06:31 PM

Sorry, but I though fractions were mathematical thingies. In that case I'd go with the geeks and the chess club types. Remember, you're most likely to end up working for a geek anyway (cf. Bill Gates)!

Insidious Rex · 09-16-2009, 02:03 PM

As a species we tend to need to pigeon hole each other so we can know what we are up against. Invariably of course the pigeon holes arent perfect but it doesnt really matter for the sake of division is accomplished. And this probably dates back to the dawn of our evolution when it was imperative to our survival to have a kind of tribe identification way of thinking. And millions of years later we see it still in our high schools...

So yes I guess what Im saying is that I do think its very much a part of us to divide and group up in this way. Especially when young. But never doubt these stereotypes, although based on some reality, are NEVER perfect and sometimes far from it. I dare so most people are too complex to be stuffed into one simple mold. JOCK. PUNK. GOTH. METAL HEAD. PREP. Im sure even on this very board dedicated to open unabashed nerdish reverence of JRR Tolkien, we have some "nerds and geeks" who just happen to love playing sports or occasionally actually go out clubbing or partying rather than staying home reading or who secretly HATE Star Trek...

Yes! It is possible!

So struggle against your innate instinct to group identify. Its the only way we can really be true to ALL aspects of ourselves.

Grey_Wolf · 09-16-2009, 02:11 PM

Thanks, IR. Very good post!

09-15-2009, 12:21 AM	#1
Grey_Wolf Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mirkwood, well actually I live in North-west Scania, Sweden Posts: 9,481	Natural Selection or Preordained? School are often rife with fractions - the computor club - the chess club - the jocks - and their inevitable gf's - the cheerleeders - the goth girls - the punks and so on. This kind of group creations Ive often wondered about. Is it natural selection - that is do these people live their group lives according to the age-old edict of "Survival of the Fitest" - meaning that geeks are geeks and jocks are jocks and never the two shall mingle. Or is it - in some way - preordained. A person that likes books, chess and computors - are they really supposed to be marked for life with the epithet Geeks? And the same goes for those who are very sports-oriented - are they forever also branded Jocks? Not to mention the usual image of cheerleaders - superficial airhead - is this also a given? Glad to know your views on the matter.

09-15-2009, 10:11 AM	#2
Mari Elf Lady Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale Posts: 8,588	We do not have those groups in high school. At least, they did not exist in mine. We hardly had groups at all, except for the smokers who had their own little place on the schoolgrounds, but that's it. I guess it has nothing to do with preordainment then __________________ Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply. ...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"...

09-15-2009, 12:01 PM	#3
*Jonathan* Entmoot Attorney-General, Equilibrating the Scales of Justice, Administrator ♎ Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 3,891	GW, the reality you describe is very black-and-white. Are you sure things really are that stereotyped? __________________ An unwritten post is a delightful universe of infinite possibilities. Set down one word, however, and it immediately becomes earthbound. Set down one sentence and it’s halfway to being just like every other bloody entry that’s ever been written. ☻

09-15-2009, 12:23 PM	#5
*Jonathan* Entmoot Attorney-General, Equilibrating the Scales of Justice, Administrator ♎ Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 3,891	Well it isn't a teen movie if it isn't ridiculously stereotyped __________________ An unwritten post is a delightful universe of infinite possibilities. Set down one word, however, and it immediately becomes earthbound. Set down one sentence and it’s halfway to being just like every other bloody entry that’s ever been written. ☻

09-15-2009, 06:31 PM	#6
inked Elf Lord Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: sikeston, MO, usa, earth, sol Posts: 3,114	Sorry, but I though fractions were mathematical thingies. In that case I'd go with the geeks and the chess club types. Remember, you're most likely to end up working for a geek anyway (cf. Bill Gates)! __________________ Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941

09-15-2009, 12:16 PM	#4
Grey_Wolf Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mirkwood, well actually I live in North-west Scania, Sweden Posts: 9,481	Well there must be some basis for all these teenage movies, dont you think?

09-16-2009, 02:03 PM	#7
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	As a species we tend to need to pigeon hole each other so we can know what we are up against. Invariably of course the pigeon holes arent perfect but it doesnt really matter for the sake of division is accomplished. And this probably dates back to the dawn of our evolution when it was imperative to our survival to have a kind of tribe identification way of thinking. And millions of years later we see it still in our high schools... So yes I guess what Im saying is that I do think its very much a part of us to divide and group up in this way. Especially when young. But never doubt these stereotypes, although based on some reality, are NEVER perfect and sometimes far from it. I dare so most people are too complex to be stuffed into one simple mold. JOCK. PUNK. GOTH. METAL HEAD. PREP. Im sure even on this very board dedicated to open unabashed nerdish reverence of JRR Tolkien, we have some "nerds and geeks" who just happen to love playing sports or occasionally actually go out clubbing or partying rather than staying home reading or who secretly HATE Star Trek... Yes! It is possible! So struggle against your innate instinct to group identify. Its the only way we can really be true to ALL aspects of ourselves. __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

09-16-2009, 02:11 PM	#8
Grey_Wolf Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mirkwood, well actually I live in North-west Scania, Sweden Posts: 9,481	Thanks, IR. Very good post!

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